Paul supporters stopped cold during noisy state GOP convention

There are admirable potentialities in every human being. Believe in your strength and your youth. Learn to repeat endlessly to yourself, 'It all depends on me.'

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Mike wrote:

"Most of our patriots are like guys who just read the football rules handbook playing against a practiced better team, including me."

Exactly, except I would stress 'young' patriots who have been indoctrinated in blind pacifism.

How can such a simple concept be miss-understood by someone of your learning?
When or where did I ever write or say we should stop being politically active and take up arms at this moment? Well, we would if we had a nation of brave Liberty loving men, or at least men who had a basic understanding of self government. But we don’t. Most of them are whores and have a slave mentality and thus deserve to be slaves.

If I could get 3 million plus to go to DC tomorrow and arrest, try for treason and execute every member of the socialist caucus I would do so, but they are not there. They hide in front of their weaponvisions with their remotes in their hands, oblivious.

We are forced to be ‘politically active’ because our enemies have been so successful at keeping the sheeple from understanding that the most basic right we possess is self defense, the right to fight back, to kill them when they overstep their bounds.

The Founders erected a very good system, for a population that understands what that system is and how to use it and that understands its responsibilities within it. The modern population doesn’t understand and for the most part doesn’t want to.

We are forced to be ‘politically active’ because at this point we will lose if the shooting starts because so many are so stupid as to vote for pieces of garbage as McCommie and Obamacommie. But if either of those evil creatures overstep their bounds far enough, aided or not by the Congress, we may be forced to begin shooting. This is a very simple concept and in no way says to anyone they should stop being politically active.

‘Political activity’ includes all the efforts, from handing out a Ron Paul flyer to recruiting for what may/will become necessary. The fact that so many cannot understand that shows that this new movement may be being built on sand. I cannot know this for sure but I do know I’ve encountered Ron Paul supporters who will go vote for Obama this fall because they think he’s a viable choice and because they were only in support of Paul because they were conditioned by the mainstream and some alternative news media to be ‘anti-war.’

Our enemies are not going to give up without a blood fight. They have invested too much time and money into turning this land/world into their plaything. Only if we convince or show them that continuing on their present course is unprofitable, by whatever means, will they surrender.

Let me reiterate:
It’s way past time to start considering what we will do when they try to make us like England:
http://www.willowtown.com/reality/britsinsane.htm
The operative word ‘when’ is to be noticed.

I post this same general statement wherever I can. When/if they tell us to turn our guns in the time for talk and ‘peaceful political action’ will be over. It will be time to kill the cops at the gun turn in points, the elected public servants who wrote and voted for the ‘law’ and as many of their supporters as necessary to secure/restore Liberty.

As I am not Rambo I do not expect to live through the first firefight, but I will not exist under their evil thumbs. If we let them take us past that point we deserve what they do to us.

If someone of your education cannot understand these simple concepts then the latest ‘Paulbots’ will not as well and they are all wasting their time.

And from my understanding of history the American Revolution started in some ways decades before, as did the Second American Revolution, the one the bad guys won. The south was forming and training its militias years before Lincoln was elected because many sensed what was coming.

We are woefully unprepared if the storm should come upon us in the near future. Any who do not understand how quickly it could come and what our response should be desperately need to be ‘educated.’

Dear Way Past Had Enough

I loved the quotes at willowtown. I use many in my seminars. And yes, I can anticipate your next response from Samuel Adams, “may your chains set lightly upon you”.

But I hope you will at least consider what I have to say.

The Founders did not operate in a vacuum; their development went back centuries to include the covenanters and Culloden in 1742.

Drawing applications from history is important but it takes wisdom to be like the men of Issachar who understood the times and can discern the differences. When Patrick Henry gave his speech that moved the Virginians at St. John’s Church there was already blood “on the plains of Boston”.

I respect your right to your opinion about timing but Henry made the point that they had been petitioning to no avail for 10 years. It was a tyrant they were petitioning to without one 10th of the liberties we were given and tools we have not used yet. Many felt they should continue to petition. I think they were wrong because petitions are useless. It was a close vote. Henry’s speech swayed just enough men to win the vote to arm the VA militia by a close vote.

I am a Virginian and love the South. But the South made the same mistake you are making. The South was right in principle but erred in judgment - - not about slavery but the real money issues that drove the War Between the States). Their impatience (or should I say South Carolina’s impatience because Virginia voted 3 times to stay in the Union until given no choice but to succeed) led to a 4 year disaster that we have not yet recovered from. I would have been in Southern Grey at that time because like most I would have had no choice. But you and I still have choices to make and that is why I write with hope to influence you.

We have not even begun to try and use the better tools in defense of peaceful protest and change given to us by the founders. Not because we have not cared or have not loved our dying Constitutional Republic (“there is difference between dead and almost dead” my second favorite line in Princess Bride after “life is pain, anyone who says differently is selling something) but because SO FEW understand how to use them. Most of our patriots are like guys who just read the football rules handbook playing against a practiced better team, including me. I am still learning. I am no expert but I know enough to know that there is still a lot I do not know. Don’t let your anger blind you to what we as a movement have not tried. Ron Paul is the first one to organize anything in my lifetime that was worthy of my time and efforts.

We have grown up in the climate of a mob democracy. Our citizenry is more like the French under Robespierre (sp?) than the colonies under over 250 founding fathers of incredible education and discipline, who all disagreed with each other like good patriots like you and I are disagreeing.

Yes, I have kids, and for their sake we ought to exhaust the tools of peaceful change as Ron Paul is trying to do. If those tools are ineffective then let it be evident to all. One of the principles I teach in our invitation only school of effective political action is this. IF THE THUGOCRACY IS GOING TO TRASH YOU, LET IT BE OBVIOUS TO EVERYONE. But it takes wisdom to pull that off not just legitimate anger.

If you are right and I am wrong it won’t matter anyway as you basically admit. But what a tragedy if I am right and you are wrong. A voice like yours could be tremendous in helping harness the awesome anger and energy of Ron Paul’s supporters. That is because you have credibility with some elements of the movement that I never could or will.

Anger is a powerful energizer if directed and harnessed effectively.

If I am not the most hated Virginia Republican Party Officer in Virginia, I must be a close second or at least 3rd.

Please don't interpret a non response to you if you reply as anything other than my having limited time for this debate.

With Esteem and For Liberty
Mike McHugh
Warren Co Virginia RPV Vice Chair

Note to Virginia Patriot about KY Events and those in Blind copy

My reading of the KY events leads me to believe that the KY RP folks were not organized with the right whip action floor organization to win, even rump the convention if necessary.

They lost for the same reason Marshall lost the floor VA floor fight. Marshall had no plan with one floor leader who could communicate instantly to all in the room the right actions to do at the right time.

Sounds like the RP folks did not have a plan to fight for temp chair which is the most important vote. You have to know the right motions to force a vote but even that is useless without ONE and ONLY one floor leader who knows what to do when the meeting turns to chaos as it always will.

I hope they learn the right lesson. The restoration of liberty will one long protracted fight after another.

If they learn the wrong lessons from their loss they will dissipate. If they learn the right ones they will grow and become stronger. If they had won the fight for Temp Chair, which is your first test vote and controls EVERYTHING from there on out, they would have been in control. If you lose that vote then a savvy floor leader can still fight a few other issues but for reasons different than actually being heard or winning

You cannot possibly study the rules of chess or football and be angry that you lost because professional chess players and thugocracy football players beat you.

I hope that keep the KY patriots keep at it. The RPV, as Ron Paul knows, is the ONLY vehicle we have for the peaceful restoration of liberty and the Constitution. It will be a long protracted fight where we fight to learn and grow for the next fight.

We did not lose our liberties over night, nor will they be restored overnight.

As T.S. Ellito said, there is no such thing as a lost cause, because there is no such thing as a gained cause, we fight for lost causes, knowing that our defeat or disaster may be the preface to our successors victory, though that victory too will be temporary, we fight rather to keep truth alive.

Liberty is worth fighting for. I hope someone can harness and train these awesome warriors for liberty.

I will try and post this on the KY blog for you will.

Thanks for sending it.

For Liberty

Mike McHugh Warren County Virginia RPV Vice-Chairman

I wasn't there, but after reading various articles and listening to things, Mr. Robertson struck me as out of line.

But what should we expect, I mean, the GOP elected a liberal to represent their "conservative" policies. I'm a member of the GOP who is considering leaving. It seems to me, that Chris H is correct: that the GOP is dying a very painful death. I wouldn't be saddened if the Libertarian party rises in its ashes as the true conservative party. And I have to confess, Ron Paul was the only one demanding adherence to the Constitution all throughout the race. That's a solid thing.

All these heavy-handed tactics will be remembered in November. All the Ron Paul supporters wanted was to participate. Get ready for Obama...maybe we can salvage the Republican Party in four years if the USA still exists.

If you join a 3rd Party, the Republocrats make the rules so it is impossible to win. If you join the Republicans, they change the rules and make it impossible to win. This is a CATCH 22. The only thing left to us is to disobey the rules. If you do this, you will be jailed and eventually killed. It is said of authoritarian states, that when power has completely corrupted, those that are in jail will be the best in society and those in power will be among the worst. How far off are we from this today?

I don’t take the time to fight this awful beast that is the state that we created. I do things that I can do outside of their purview. I buy gold. I talk to the few friends I have outside of work. I do pay my taxes and if the state ever comes to my door with their arbitrary laws, I humbly ask them what have I done to offend them and what can I do to remedy the situation to satisfy their interests. I am servile to them and intend to remain so. For there is nothing a man like me with a family can do but accept my fate. I have children who depend on me. Going against the state would threaten their well being. Yes, it is humiliating and frustrating, but it is the choice that we are forced to make because we are only 1 against their huge apparatus. We are conquered and we are the chattel of their whims, not ours.

Rising up against them is romantic and idealized by those who would call my submission cowardly. My question to them is what have they done to stop this state of affairs? I am proud that I have thrown away my vote in every election. I have never voted for anyone who has actually won any office. I guess you could say that I wasted my vote. Can most people even say that? The facts are that there will be no resistance until the state makes our lives so horrible that even death would be preferable to living the next hour under their rule. This is the way it has always been and always will be.

The sad thing for us is we are in a negative trend of history. Things get worse daily instead of better and the things that are getting worse are increasing exponentially, not arithmetically. No real wealth is being created, resources are becoming scarce, and all in all people will be impoverished and predisposed to violence when all is said and done. The hope for a better tomorrow is always something that lifts the human spirit. With the trends what they are today, that hope is fading.

The convention was a sham; the rules were not followed.

Although Robertson claims the agenda was passed by unanimous consent, it was never voted on. But at this convention it seems "unanimous" means the chairman decides so.

The chairman does not have these rights he assumed for himself - such as cutting off a motion from the floor without a vote, even if there had been a properly approved agenda.

All the carrying on about how they support the troops, right after silencing a military person nearly made me ill. It's just politics at its lowest - catch phrases to get sympathy, with no meaning behind them.

There is nothing surprising about the way the RPK and its corrupt chairman behaved. You had only 500 - 550 people show up out of delegated thousands of Republicans. And all your votes at the convention were approx. 300 - 225 votes. But yet the "Christian socialists" of the party want to censor and shut down any constitutional Republicans. Look at the list of national delegates, with typical big government RINOS like Deanna Brangers, Faith Mercke and Ellen Williams on the list.

I attended this convention as a delegate from Fayette County and I was angered and very ashamed of the Republican Party of Kentucky for their behavior.

There was no intent to disrupt the proceedings. If the intent was to be disruptive the convention could have been halted, but that clearly was not the intent. About 20% of the delegates simply wanted to be heard.

The convention was originally intended to be a deliberative body, where each county sends delegates to discuss and debate issues and produce a consensus on all issues. Not anymore. This was a sham convention, with all matters pre-decided. No questions were allowed on any subject, much less any substantive debate as there should have been.

The GOP had sent a pre-recorded message from John McCain urging people to attend the convention to prevent divisive elements from taking over the convention, they were bussed in to fill seats. I think some selective emails to party insiders were even more strongly worded to pre-dispose delegates toward a dislike of those portrayed as interlopers and even anarchists.

The Ron Paul supporters had the choice between:

A) Voting with the chair.

B) Voting against the chair.

C) Trying to use Roberts Rules of Order to have a voice, and being shouted down by the chair and made to look like the disruptive element they had been portrayed to be.

Since when is representing your county and speaking at the state convention "disruptive"? How can a motion be ruled as out of order before it's even been heard?

I saw a veteran whose husband is active duty military attempt to speak on a point of order, but I never heard her point, because Steve Robertson shouted her down and gaveled her down, and then sent the sergeant of arms to eject her.

Republican politicians have become increasingly less conservative lately, but I've never been so ashamed to be a Republican. The RPK should be ashamed too.

They may think they've won, but cheaters never win. They've proven their corruption and heavy handed back room deal making, and this has changed some dedicated hard working people who naively thought they could work within the party. They should have been eagerly invited into the GOP, which is pathetically weak in Kentucky and growing weaker, but they were shut out in a vicious and divisive manner. These people will now sacrifice greatly and they will reform the party, and those who have stopped them at the convention will be ousted... and good riddance.

I attended the convention as a guest...on neither one side nor the other...and I left with a belief that there is no democracy or representation in politics. It was very sad to see Mr. Roberts conduct him in the way that he did....and for that matter, the rest of the republican party. I saw no attempts to disrupt the convention, merely an attempt to level the playing field and have a voice. The Ron Paul supporters should have been given time to speak and debate. Sadly, they weren't.